We must cut all options for the end user to own anything, let’em pay subscriptions instead.
In a SONY board meeting, probably.
Why are we suddenly selling more NAS grade HDDs?
- Seagate executives
Are we back to trusting Seagate again? Last I knew their spinning rust was t trust worthy. I’ve had 6 drives fail me in the last 2 decades, and all but one or two were Seagate, so I just assume their bad anymore and go with other suppliers.
Every drive I’ve had fail, personally or professionally, has been a Seagate drive.
Every drive I’ve had failed was WD. My Seagates have been mostly fine
Seagate does seem to have a higher failure rate, but they are also cheaper. From this article:
The oldest (average age of 92.5 months) hard drive Backblaze tested was a 6TB Seagate (ST6000DX000). Its AFR was 0.11 percent in 2021 and 0.68 percent in 2022. Backblaze said this was “a very respectable number any time, but especially after nearly eight years.”
…
“In general, Seagate drives are less expensive and their failure rates are typically higher in our environment,” Backblaze said. “But, their failure rates are typically not high enough to make them less cost-effective over their lifetime. You could make a good case that for us, many Seagate drive models are just as cost-effective as more expensive drives.”
Their oldest drives are Seagate as well, so that’s saying something.
Whether a drive will be reliable for you is less related to the manufacturer and more related to capacity and luck.
Here’s an anecdote from Reddit:
I’ve had numerous hard drive failures over the years – nothing atypical, I just use lots of drives, and like almost everything else, they have stochastic failures. But between Seagate and WD, the Seagate drives all at least let me know they were going to fail soon, via SMART monitoring, and gave me (just) ample time to get all of my data off of them before completely dying. My WD drives that failed did so instantaneously, without any prior indication of problems.
But this could also be luck, idk. My takeaway is:
- Seagate has a little higher failure rate, which explains why they’re often cheaper
- Seagate may do a good job detecting errors with SMART
- all drives fail and whether one will fail before another is more likely up to luck than any systemic issue by a manufacturer
Something tells me the market for media servers is very different than the market for BD-R. The only benefit to having a collection of burned discs over a NAS is that you can let people borrow them. It’s otherwise mostly downsides
If they were cheaper I’d use them for archival purposes. They work well as cold storage.
If you have a Nas… install plex or jellyfin and you can still let them “borrow” it all the same…
Far from a “downside”.
I got mine in November
Recommendations?
I’ve put together a RAID 1 of these and some 860 Evo QLC Hard to say if they’ll last as long as BD but you can’t beat the capacity
https://visiontek.com/products/visiontek-tlc-7mm-2-5-ssd-sata-enterprise
Nah, probably just didn’t sell enough, with USB sticks around and all.
I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone use the format. CDR saw a lot of use, but who needs bluray nowadays?
This is not as big a deal as you think. Blu-Ray production itself isn’t ending, they just aren’t making any more rewritable Blu-Rays. Most people aren’t going to be burning stuff to Blu-Rays. You’ll still be able to buy Blu-Rays if you want a physical copy of a film.
Eh, I doubt many people are burning their own Blu-ray discs - this does not apply to discs you buy that already have films on, those are manufactured differently, and are still being made.
But even if you do archive your personal data onto Blu-ray discs, there are still other manufacturers besides Sony.
This really isn’t a big deal.
This really isn’t a big deal.
Sure. One tiny bit at a time…
Really though, who burns Blu rays. Yes I’m sure there’s a handful of people out there doing it but I don’t know anyone who’s still burning discs in 2024. Storage space is large and cheap now and way less hassle than discs. Companies as big as Sony can’t keep producing products for a tiny market it just doesn’t make sense.
Yup. I use a NAS to not have to deal with disks. I’d rather buy a couple more drives than have to store even more stuff at home.
Who still burns discs (outside of retro gamers) in 2024, let alone Blu-Rays? They aren’t killing the whole format.
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What does a movie company not producing movies on discs have to do with ending production of rewrite-able discs?
Different divisions. This is more akin to when Sony decided to stop making floppy disks. The market is there for now, but it’s just not worth it from a financial perspective.
The amount of people burning their own blu rays is minimal. Even the type of people who emphasize owning their own content just use a NAS system.
This is more akin to when Sony decided to stop making floppy disks. The market is there for now, but it’s just not worth it from a financial perspective.
Ironically Japan is just now phasing out floppies, so there’ll still be a market for a while.
A NAS is mostly geared for online media storage, whereas disks are for offline.
That’s just the government though, similar to how a lot of the systems in the US still run on COBOL (including the IRS).
25GB and 50GB disks written at blistering 10MB/s in the age of 100MB/s Gigabit Internet connected to storage (S3, Backblaze, etc. etc.) means that networks have completely obsoleted Blu Rays.
I’m surprised they still found a use of these things. Flash drives are also so much cheaper, faster, and more convenient.
I know for some secure purposes they still use CDs because they’re a lot harder to sneak around than a flash drive. There are still some uses, but they’re very niche. There’s essentially zero purpose for personal use.
One TB capacity in a sd micro flash disk equivalent to twenty Blu-ray discs at 50GB, just no comparison in the growth of technology.
I find it kinda funny Sony tried so hard to own the standard so many times thought they eventually got it but then the Internet made it irrelavent almost instantly.
I don’t like Sony.
Am with you. Their midrange phones still have headphone jacks, though. I like that.
Yeah their phones do generally still do things like microsds etc which is very nice I also like the psp but I’ve bought so many Sony products that develop weird faults straight after the warranty and the fact they alway push propriety cards etc.
Its a weird company where divisions seem to actively sabotage each other I just don’t trust them at all.
I also like the psp
I like it too. I’ve even made a few calls with the Skype version for it.
Lots of Star Wars and Forgotten Realms and Russian fantasy books and lots of porn stories have been read in its web browser.
The music player felt nice.
In general, I feel like that’s how “smartphones” should be.
PSP is probably the best thing Sony ever made even considering the Walkman when they were a a+ Company. Psp has some super gems the sad fact is the Vita could have easily been even bigger if Sony themselves didn’t jump through hoops sabotaging the thing.
The things they did that ruined it was using their own very bad card that barely lasted 6 months over microsd and they gave all the big title game releases to absolute garbage company’s like Nihilistic who have now renamed themselves several times because they make pure trash so they have to .
I’m also pretty bitter over their top of the range Bluetooth speaker which for me began switching between bass mode and treble mode every two seconds straight after the warranty I mean maybe two days after . The fault make no sense at all if it was the button there would be a normal mode in there and I’d barely used the thing at all I’d used it maybe 6 tines. So to me that’s the killer how could such a fault happen if it wasn’t designed to.
I mean if the fault made any real sense I would have bought it but it was ridiculous and then I started reading about the Sony kill switch etc.
Vita
PSP-2008 (slim) is the best IMHO, fewer things to break mechanically, immortal buttons, big enough for my clumsy hands.
and they gave all the big title game releases to absolute garbage company’s like Nihilistic who have now renamed themselves several times because they make pure trash so they have to .
We-ell, I played a few Star Wars games on it, and some more. Would like plain Battlefront II there, though. And playing KotOR II: TSL on PSP lying in grass in summer in sunny windy weather would be glorious.
Sony kill switch
That’s the company that would distribute trojans on official CDs.
One of the reasons I was sympathetic to Apple at some point (EDIT: in the sense that them being malicious didn’t frighten me off) was that I liked PSP and Sony was just as bad. Then I realized that Apple simply doesn’t offer anything interesting though. Eh, neither did Sony after PSP.
Sony phones are pretty great for stuff like this tbh
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MicroSD
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dual SIM
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headphone jacks (this is despite Sony being one of the biggest names in Bluetooth audio and therefore more likely to benefit from getting rid of 3.5mm)
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they stuck to notification LEDs longer than anybody (sadly stopped on their newest gen IIRC?
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dedicated 2-stage camera shutter buttons
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no notch, no hole punch
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stereo, front-facing speakers
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first to embrace water resistance on smartphones
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an OS that doesn’t treat you like a complete baby. It shows some relatively advanced options in the settings app and actually explains what they mean and why you’d want to use them. I appreciate that.
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shockingly FOSS friendly, even going as far as providing bootable AOSP builds on their GitHub, as well as contributing more to AOSP code than anybody other than Google themselves, despite being a niche OEM. A lot of the battery optimisations in Android are actually a Sony contribution, for example.
There’s a few things that suck. They need to extend their software support, their naming is dreadful (yes I know it follows the camera division naming, it’s still dumb), and they try to charge Apple/Samsung prices despite not being in the same dominant market position. But overall their Xperia division actually puts out some good stuff IMO.
(this is despite Sony being one of the biggest names in Bluetooth audio and therefore more likely to benefit from getting rid of 3.5mm)
What’s fun about that is the bluetooth sucks in many experia phones. So if someone wanted to use a bluetooth device they’d be better off just getting a new phone. My friend has fun with his Tesla where his wife has to turn bluetooth off on her phone before they get in otherwise the car will only connect to her phone and not load his profile/get angry if she gets out.
Sounds like a Tesla issue
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I mean, as long as there is a hard copy archive option out there this is ok (cloud is already flirting with copyblight).
At least they’re not enforcing Memory Stick on us again.
I’ve never had a need to burn a blu-ray. When bd-r’s hit the scene with their obscenely priced recording drives, it was only maybe a year or two before flash memory had already become cheap and fast enough that any volume of data large enough to justify a BD was better served on a 16/32gb thumbdrive unless it needed to be distributed in volume, and I’ve never needed to make enough identical copies of something to justify the $200-$300 that the first drives cost.
It sucks losing an option but I actually doubt most anyone will notice. 3rd party manufacturers will keep making disc’s for a while anyway, Sony is far from the only company doing this technology.
I use archival blurays for cheap, deep storage for decade plus usage, not something I’d trust to flash memory or even a hard drive. Tape is an option of course but that’s pricey.
Good. Flash storage is everywhere now. Why go through an extra layer of proprietary hardware and DRM when you can have direct access to the video files which can be read on any platform?
The DRM is extra awful with bluray, its usefullness is dipressingly lmited. Being propriatary makes it worthless as an archive medium.
Don’t fret, Verbatim will still be making recordable BD-Rs. However, this will mean that there will be no more 128GB BD-Rs, we’ll be stuck with only 100GB BD-Rs (Sony is the only company that makes 128GB Blu-rays).
I recently ordered a pack of 128GBs from Japan. I’d recommend you do the same, because the prices are gonna skyrocket.
May I ask what uses you have for them?
Backing up personal data, mostly stuff from my childhood that is irreplacable. Sure, I could just put them on a HDD, but then I’d have to replace it every 5-10 years. Data stored on Blu-ray can last a long time.
Data on hard drives also generally lasts a long time. Much longer than 5-10 years.
And make sure you’re constantly monitoring those discs, disc rot is very much a thing for all optical medica.
Assuming the drive spins back up after being left in a cupboard for 15 years, if you’re still even able to find a computer compatible with whatever cables it used back then. But yeah.
If proper SATA ever goes away, I’d wager that there will still be SATA-to-USB adapters on sale. Heck, people still find ways to connect floppy drives to their modern PCs.
MDiscs are ISO rated for hundreds to thousands of years.
https://www.ecma-international.org/wp-content/uploads/ECMA-379_3rd_edition_june_2010.pdf
Rated for, but that doesn’t mean they’re all actually manufactured to that standard.
CDs were rated for like 50+ years originally I think. We found out real quick that was an optimistic number, especially when you buy the cheapest thing around.
Bluray disk cost 25$ for 50gb and usb flash drive cost 5$ for 64gb
How can I afford to buy Criterion Collection Blu-Rays for $14.99 if blu-ray discs cost $25?
That’s read-only, not read/write, plus they’re buying bulk.
Economy of scale and also slightly different, but related, media format. Criterion has them printed in bulk.
Yeah ok, but as we’ve established in this thread, Blu Ray discs don’t cost $25 a piece. At any level. So.
Again, writable Blu-ray is a slightly different format from what you would buy with a movie on it. They are not putting Criterion movies on the same discs you could burn them to in a drive.
Damn, a 50gb blu ray costs 2€ in my country.
for 35€ you can get 512gb flash drive. kinda insane to think about that. maybe even cheaper but that was just what I found from my local store
Yes, flash memory came a very long way, when current nodes of 3nm going to be old enough for mass producing growth memory, there’s gonna be 5tb microsd cards probably, since we’re already having 2tb ones https://www.tomsguide.com/news/the-worlds-first-2tb-microsd-card-is-here-what-you-need-to-know
the storage density growth is so mindboggling that I find myself hesitant to trust it lol. 2tb?
fuck me running
It’s getting harder and harder to make things smaller, but they are making things thinner now, which means they can layer them, thus increasing density.
The 25GB disks are like 10¢.
Where? I see only 30$ for 5pack of 25gb bd-r
Oh well. I use memorex anyway
I use Maxell. Because I’m a cool 80s guy.
Uhm sorry to rain on your parade, but all the cool people made fun of Maxwell guys back then. Our Nakamichi ‘gons got fed TDK exclusively…
RIP
No no, these are for burning.
Damn, the end of an era. I wonder how anime will be sold in Japan now if not on Blu-rays?
They sell anime on recordable Blu-rays? Surely they use normal Blu-rays?
Okay yep, I am too tired two days in a row.
I thought it was all Blu-ray’s, not just recordable (re-recordable?) ones.
I thought it meant that like, yeah Blu-ray’s in general are being phased out.
In your defense, a bunch of the earlier reports about this straight up implied that was the case for the clickbait.
It’s recordable Blu-Rays, not the entire format.
I really wish there was a viable alternative for physical backups. Blu-ray just doesn’t have enough storage space, tape is expensive, and hard drives need to be periodically read.
I’ve read about holographic WORM media, but I just don’t think there’s enough consumer demand for the hardware and media to ever be as affordable as blu-ray.
Once upon a time, I could back up all my important data to a stack of DVD-Rs. How am I supposed to back up a 100TB NAS, though? The “best” alternative is to build a second NAS for backup, but that’s approaching tape drive levels of cost.
Checkout AWS S3 “Deep Glacier Archive”. It’s perfect for data you only “read” in recovery events, since you have to wait up to 12 hours to retrieve the data. I backup my Plex this way.
Based on their 100T of data the .00099 per GB pricing will have them spending $99 a month, or $1200 a year, for backup.
Yup, that’s why I don’t bother backing up media to places like S3 or B2, I only back up important stuff like family pictures and tax documents. Replacing my DVD or Bluray collection is feasible, it just costs time and money, but I can’t replace pictures and whatnot.
I just double my HDDs and put them in RAID1. Not foolproof against data loss, but I wouldn’t be heartbroken if I lost my Plex library. For important docs I add a cloud backup.
3-2-1 is the way to go.
It’s the answer. It’s the reason.
Did anyone ever burn their blu ray discs? There has been so many better options like USB sticks and external hard drives ever since the launch of blu ray.
Yes, they are the best medium for long term backups, as optical discs should be fine for decades. Hard drives and USB sticks are liable to fail within a few years.
Me, with a 200 Terrabyte usb drive, wondering why this is an issue.
I use BD-R for archival storage of important files. They’re cheaper and easier than tape as well as small. I burn them in triplicate and throw them in the same case and as long as the same 3 bits don’t corrupt I can recover. The shelf life on a blue ray sealed and stored well is a few decades which is better than most other media.
I understand that from a business perspective, but I’m having a hard time rationalizing it for personal use.
I guess, if you’re doing a lot of video editing and you want to preserve a large personal library? Idk.
How often do you lend your drives to your friends? A cheap way to send big files without internet connection was paramount for sharing information.
Very rarely. I tend to have shared text or Excel files to actively share and work on. Nothing in the hundreds of gigs.
