Didn’t know China has the same workaholic mentality as the US lol
Its so much worse in east asia. Japan and especially SK are even worse.
And some people still think that China is communist. Nah it’s just capitalism with a different flavor. Same goes for Vietnam which recently joined some wacky ass organisation of a certain orange American neoimperialist.
Vietnam is just a Chinese work around for US tariffs.
chinas a communist country and authoritarian
china is a late stage capitalist techno feudalism state
Pick a comment and it probably is one of these two
China is actually a socialist democratic state, that is the political doctrine, their party was formed by marxists and communists but this applies to all current socialist states when looking at the origins of their governing bodies and the creation of those states. For the economic doctrine, they just really used their head and created a very well executed model that is relatively new in economy.
It’s usually called a social market economy and it uses the best traits capitalism can offer for growth and scale whilst containing it so it remains innovative and improves the economic situation of it’s citizens. It’s well secured to not allow internal corruption (see what happened when Jack Ma thought he was as polically powerful as US billionaires) and structures like state councils to approve or refuse mergers if they deem it attempts at building monopolies. Wether it will fail or not, all economic models have always had one thing in common; they are born, change through time, evolve and die eventually. That is their only common trait aside from their fundamental nature in being ideological systems to manage ressources. Capitalism may die within the next 100 years if the trends of what has happened in the last 20 years keep themselves up but yeah, it should not be dismissed because of the historical chinese/western frictions.
It’s insane to be that you claim it doesn’t allow internal corruption when China is a very corrupt system.
There may be good systematic economy foundations, I can’t speak much about those, but if they’re not applied to everyone and just then it’s besides the point.
Thanks for sharing! Love those #llm responses; just a tad biased, but so balanced and well-worded!
China produced more billionaires than the US this year. The only way they accomplished this is to allow unfettered capitalism which is very evident. There is no going back and the billionaires will be calling the shots before to long. They are just another fascist nation at this point and the fourth/fifth largest producer of weapons to boot.
Nah…Jack Ma tried to fuck around with government and they shut him down.
Oh you mean one wealthy person tried to fuck with other wealthy people’s money? I don’t think this example is what you think it is. Old money versus new money conflicts are pretty common and Jack found that out the hard way.
The difference between Chinese billionaires and American billionaires is that the Chinese ones are owned by the government. To set up any company in China requires part government ownership of, I think, 15%.
There is no way the billionaires are calling the shots, ever, while Xi is in power. As if he would allow what’s happening in America, happen in China.
Remember what happened to the CEO of Alibaba? Jack Ma? When he became rich enough to potentially take over the country?
There is no way the billionaires are calling the shots, ever, while Xi is in power
Much like Putin and the Russian oligarchy, who they either play with him or be shown the window.
Lol sure, they won’t be calling the shots. I think you forget how capitalism works.
What happens when there are a thousand billionaires? The government is not going to round them all up. Naw, they are going to call the shots.
Already corporations keep getting more and more regulations and laws written at their request. It is already happening and will continue to accelerate.
Welcome to the fascist world.
But China isn’t a crony capitalist country like America. The money is set up to always favour the government over there.
Things are the way they are in places like America because the government exists because of the billionaires (bribery, lobbying etc). In places like China, the billionaires exist because of the government (surveillance, prison sentences etc). This is most likely because Xi is driven by ideology, not greed.
The only way for the billionaires to take over China at the moment is to come together and start their own army to go to war. No way that’s going to happen because wars are a drain on capital.
China is controlled by a group of wealthy elite people. The wealthy people don’t need to make an army to take control just like the wealthy people of the US don’t. You seem to be confused about how things really work.
I am sure there are interesting power dynamics between old and new wealth in China just like the US. As their wealthy class explodes so will their their proxies the corporation thus increasing their power to lobby. The fascist cycle repeats.
First, we do not know this, even the weather channel provides the odds of something happening alongside a reminder that future outcomes cannot be predicted with certainty. Second, they are fundamentally different:
American capitalism: Maximization of individual economic freedom and utility. The system is designed to facilitate capital accumulation, innovation, and consumer choice through decentralized decision-making. The individual (consumer, investor, entrepreneur) is the primary unit of analysis which in turn is often a source of criticism due to the individualist nature of the social doctrine. The “invisible arbitrator (state)” of the market is trusted to aggregate individual choices into the best possible social outcomes but as seen recently, this trust has no incentive and can be taken advantage of leading to internal corruption and instance of accumulation of powers. Process is paramount: free choice, free competition, and profit motive are both the means and the implicit ends. It was also a direct response by John Locke to the issues caused by mercantilism and was created in the 1689 if I remember correctly.
Chinese socialism: National rejuvenation and the perpetuation of the ruling party’s governance (let us remember that this is a country that is still less than 100 years old). Economic development is a critical tool for ensuring state sovereignty, social stability, and the legitimacy of the Peoples republic of China, which in turn is governed by a marxist-leninist influenced communist party. The economy is a subsystem of the state, not a separate sphere. It draws from Confucian traditions of a meritocratic, guiding state (similar to marx’s conclusion “From each according to his ability to each according to his needs” on the flaws of the 19th century german socialist democracy present in his last volume, Kritik Des Gothaer Programs). The collective (nation, party, society) is the primary unit of analysis. Economic growth is a means to power, stability, and civilizational restoration. The system is teleological oriented toward a specific end-state (a “modern socialist,” strong nation, correcting the post-modern false narrative that communism does not work which is a complete generalization and misdirected association on why certain states failed, yet cuba remains and has been for over a century even with the american embargo still being present). Efficiency matters, but only insofar as it serves the ultimate political goals.
The competition between them is not just economic so we can be clear; it is a competition between two fundamentally different logics of social organization: one rooted in individual autonomy and decentralized choice, the other in collective goals and centralized coordination. The 21st century will be a live test of their relative performance and resilience and I think of it as amazing that we get front row seats to see this.
So uh, did this guy who died get what he needed while he literally worked himself to death?
No? Oh. To each according to their needs huh?
I don’t really mind much of what Marx wrote in theory, but it actually has to work in practice first.
I am sorry, but I don’t buy into any of this competition nonsense. The simple fact is China is great because of the US not despite it. They are number one trading partners and along with Russia make up the new “petro alliance”. It is pretty obvious what has happened really.
Nations are no longer in control, I won’t pretend China is any different at this point. A bunch of corporations calling the shots with decorations of communism or democracy. Propaganda used to convince people the government is more than a puppet to the wealthy at this point.
The only person who benefits from choosing to pursue truth than eat up propagandized unsourced theories is the self. I’ve taken some time to put pretty simple and evident, verifiable information right up there, if you wish to ignore it, you’re the only one affected by it, I win nothing else than the pleasure of sharing and explaining information that I think is representative of things as they exist in our world.
I have chosen the path of academic information such as books and papers to back up my beliefs, and not of oversimplified information with no source. Do you really believe that world politics and diplomatical relationships of the biggest superpowers layered on top of an information war that spans more than a century opposing the colonial post-colonial western states to the anti-colonial and anti-imperial global south can really be summed up to “It’s pretty obvious what has happened really”? It almost sound like satire when I read it again.
Oh please China is a dictatorship, not communist or socialist. Just like the USA is not really a democracy, but a fascist oligarchy. There is a huge difference between what a nation says it is and what it actually is.
They are our “enemy” but also one of our favorite trading partners. US citizens have invested a ridiculous amount of money into China just like every country. China is great because of the US not despite it.
You have chosen the path of eating up propaganda and regurgitating it without realizing. With no critical lense you just believe whatever information they offer up to you. Everything you write must be satire I guess.
It’s well secured to not allow internal corruption
Meanwhile in China: from taizi dang, to current and bi-yearly purges because of corruption, including people very close to Xi.
A lot of humans will also die in the next 20 years due to climate change. It’s funny you think we’re just gonna keep on keeping on once climate change gets really bad everywhere.
Some lucky manager just found his bottom 5% for the force ranked annual review. /s
Seriously, if you’ve ever managed in large corporation, you’ll understand this.
His ‘fainting’ was likely cardiac arrest. It sounds a lot like heart attack symptoms.
I have heard of this happening to people in the US who work in finance. It’s never ‘overwork’ here. It’s just a heart attack from poor life style choices.
On occasions I have done overtime or feel under pressure due to work, I do feel my heart palpitating. But I am lucky I immigrated to a country where the work culture is more relaxed compared to others. Had I gone to another country, I might have ended up the same as the guy in the article.
Known as 過労死 (karoshi) in Japan, sadly not a new concept. This is the result of the misconception that working harder will yield better results - it only leads to stagnation and ruin. Hoping that more people will realise this and initiate some change in the work culture; not only in Asia, but in the West too… The work culture in both the US, UK and many parts of the EU needs some serious overhaul.
Currently playing Cyberpunk2077.
Kind of fascinating how this word sounds very similar to ‘Kiroshi’ which is a fictious corporate providing optical eye implants.
It could be a play on words based on the root verb 切る (cut). 切ろ死 (kiroshi) could then mean something like “cut to death”, a very reassuring name for a surgical implant corporation.
Great. A double meaning :D
It’s not really “know as 過労死” in Japanese. That’s just the words for “excess”, “work”, and “death”. That’s kinda like saying “it’s known as ‘overworking to death’ in Britain”.
That’s like saying Feuetzeug is not a real German word because it’s just the words Feuer and Zeug and it’s kinda like saying “fire thing” in Britain
You have no idea how Japanese works, don’t you?
Quite the communism they are doing huh
China is not communist in any form anymore, they’re authoritarian late stage techno-capitalism with remnants of communist social structures. And before someone says “but they execute billionaires”, they only execute billionaires that get in the way of other billionaires’ profits, they never execute billionaires for being billionaires or for making those billions by exploiting the workers.
China is not communist in any form anymore
Just a planned economy governed by it’s native population with a public policy centered on general social welfare.
Nothing Communist about this at all, no sir.
And before someone says “but they execute billionaires”, they only execute billionaires that get in the way of other billionaires’ profits
That’s certainly the American spin. It’s actually double-plus capitalism when you prosecute plutocrats. Because a rules based national order promoted domestic growth. And that’s… bad?
Anyway, don’t ask about their social housing, public education, public health care, and public mass transit. That’s Not Real Communism!
Planned economy is not a defining feature of communism, nor is it exclusive to it.
governed by it’s native Population
It’s governed by the CCP that violently suppresses all dissent.
with a public policy centered on general social welfare.
I’m sure the people living in huts they just bulldoze to build highways will agree.
Communism would be a classless society free from rulers. I see neither condition fulfilled.
An important defining feature is ownership of the means of production by the workers (not the authoritarian single party government that claims to speak for them and tolerates no dissent). There literally can be no billionaire company owner under communism.
It’s governed by the CCP that violently suppresses all dissent.
Based if true
I’m sure the people living in huts they just bulldoze to build highways will agree.
source: NYT, The gaurdian, CNN
Communism would be a classless society free from rulers. I see neither condition fulfilled.
No one says they have achieved communism
The US labor laws are not far behind the fucked up Chinese 9-9-6.
Wasn’t that deemed illegal back in 2021 by the Chinese Courts?
And didn’t it kick off a wave of labor protests? The lie flat movement?
I saw a bunch of articles in the past few weeks about seniors needing to work more years and the idea of retirement in the US “needing to change”. Presumably because we are tossing out big chiunks or our labor force and probably social security will be gutted by the republicans.
Just wait… they can get worse. And will if we don’t have free and fair elections anymore.
China needs unions.
“But China is a communist utopia!!! It’s a dictatorship of the proletariat! Any criticism of the CCP is western propaganda!!!”
-tankies
We’ve all seen some of the cool elements on RedHat. I especially like the local farmer trucks rolling through towns with fresh veggies. And watching how much easier it is to grow tea there than in my backyard.
But let’s not play pretend.
People in China really need to do what their anthem says:
起来，不愿做奴隶的人们 (Arise, those who refuse to be slaves)
Thank you for this
Oh I’m sure that’ll go perfectly well in China!
Maybe ask some students on how well that went when they protested on some big square there…
They were manipulated by CIA plants that were murdering Chinese army soldiers. So. There’s that part of the story that caused the states response.
Username checks out.
Tankies will always find any excuse to say China can do no wrong, and if they do it’s the west’s fault…
“We had to massacre those protesters, you see. The US was targeting our military assets! It’s their fault.” Golly.
I mean. If labor unions killed people. Like they did during some of the coal mine riots. It gives the police and at times military freedoms to retaliate.
I grew up where the sheriff of my county killed 25 people in a single day before miner unions were allowed to exist.
Look up the Williamsport Mine Field Riots. They treated these people like animals. Just like the CCP treats their lower workers.
I’m not a tankie. I just know what happened on the ground that led up to the violence. I was in a masters program for counter terror.
Tbf they did protest against the so-called “zero covid” policy and the government sort of gave in.
Was that before or after they welded a bunch of apartment complex doors closed?
You know the answer already, but for those that don’t: after.
I’m aware. I still think they’re the country most in need of labor unions.
Oh, you were serious! Well, I think what they need is Democracy first, then unions. Communism theoretically eliminates the need for unions, but the reality is that it’s just a dictatorship. Unions in China would likely either be co-opted by the Communist party through subterfuge, or through “reeducating” the misguided leadership and defining the unions - thus landing them right where they are, with a new bureaucracy.
Unions represent the spirit of the checks and balances envisioned in the U.S. Constitution. It is only by being of near equal power to the company that employees can negotiate for fair compensation and treatment. Without that, they’re just resources. It’s an effort to use human nature to gain good outcomes.
Didn’t you hear? China’s been one gigantic people’s union since 1949. That’s the whole point of Communism. As you can see, it’s working swimmingly well.
Chinas communist party is as communist as trump is a democratic leader.
Or as our German „Christian party“ is christian…
Christianity: love thy neighbour German christianity party: the immigrants are ruining our cityscapes by their presence
Sounds like American Evangelism. I bet they coordinate.
Tiananmen square protests were (also) against introduction of capitalism to China, so… you know… (https://jacobin.com/2019/06/tiananmen-square-worker-organization-socialist-democracy)
I was implying nothing about any other type of societal organization. However, since you mention it, I will point out that Capitalism (which is an economic, not political philosophy) can become horrific for the same reasons Communism becomes horrific - People. Communism was a response to naked, mercantilist Capitalism. Marx’s heart was in the right place, but he was describing a Utopia.
I think Democracy (in its many forms) designed with checks and balances is a viable answer to the problem. It ain’t magic, though. People still need to ensure it remains balanced. We’ve been having some trouble with that lately. It took fifty years of planning for the authoritarians to get us here. It’s a good sign it was so difficult, but now we have to work hard to fix the mess.
Marx’s heart was in the right place, but he was describing a Utopia
I think Democracy (in its many forms) designed with checks and balances is a viable answer to the problem
Yeah, you wish. Electoralism will always work in favour of the wealthy class. Even damn ancient Greeks knew that https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sortition
TIL Sortition. Thanks. Your since you don’t believe in democracy, what form of governance do you feel is best?
Sortition.
Tell me you don’t know what communism is and can’t recognise a dictatorship under the guise of communism without telling me you don’t know what communism is.
I imagine that you’re from the US? If so, it’s understandable. Dr. Strangelove was what opened my eyes to how demonised it is and how misguided people in the US are to its true ideology and meaning.
The USSR, where the gov controlled most of the means of production, is the antithesis of communism.
Oh, I forgot to address the Dr. Strangelove reference. Did you know that was parody and sharp criticism of not just The United States, but of the power structures of the whole (first) world at the time? If that kind of criticism were made in the U.S.S.R. or China, Cuba, etc., of their leadership, the film would be banned and everyone involved would be imprisoned or disappeared. We’re allowed to criticize stupidity in leadership over here (for the moment). We believe it is a useful tool to try to make things better, or at least a bit more sane.
sigh. I know what communism is. I also know it’s never been implemented in real life and never will be due to the nature of a subset of humans inflicted with various personality traits like Narcissism, Psychopathy, and Sociopathy… not to mention simple greed and basic envy.
I find it interesting that you first assigned to me the characteristics of ignorance and arrogance, and then pegged me to a certain nationality, thus revealing your uninformed bias against an entire nation containing over 300 million people - many of whom probably fled whichever morally superior country you call home - simply for living there.
Now, as for the assertion that government control of the means of production is the antithesis of communism, I give you first a description of Karl Marx’s vision:
Karl Marx envisioned communal ownership on a large scale through the abolition of private property, particularly in the means of production, advocating for these assets to be owned collectively by society. He believed this would lead to a classless society where resources are distributed based on need rather than profit.
Now, has it ever crossed your mind how this could possibly be implemented? I mean when you literally have millions of people collectively owning everything and therefore whatever is needed must be somehow made available wherever it is needed. Where will things be stored, and who will manage it? Who will ensure nothing is stolen from the people? Who will ensure item or resource “A” is transited from somewhere to the place it is needed? Word of mouth? Telegraph? What if nobody feels like manning the telegraph or decides not to relay the message to the next person? Heck - how do they know who the next person is?
In any sufficiently large group of people, some form of “government” has to exist merely to facilitate meeting the needs of the people being governed. So, I put it to you that the U.S.S.R. was in fact “implementing communism” by being the “people’s government” and thus, by their logic, everything is “owned” by the government. They have to know where it is, how to protect it, how to ensure there is enough of it to meet needs, etc… Unfortunately “power corrupts”. Or in the case of the Red revolution, it decapitates a revolution for freedom and democracy the moment it wins power and takes its place.
Sarcasm. The comment you replied to was being facetious. Obviously things are not going swimmingly. Use your context clues.
Thank you for the assist. You are correct. I made the fatal assumption that most people discussing such things would have the context of Mao, the long march, the various purges, the decades of poverty, the suppression and outright murder of minorities under their belt and would recognize that the statement was so obviously false that it could only be taken as sarcasm. Unfortunately, I didn’t account for people having arrogance and a sense of other people being ignorant morons by default.
Yeah no, sounds more like a dig at communism, ya know, the usual rhetoric, hey, look at this dictatorship, as you can clearly see, communism doesn’t work
Yes. I simply found it somewhat ironic that someone would point out that a Communist nation would need unions given the definition of Communism. It was to me a Monty Python level of dry humor to suggest that, and I felt my response should match that dry humor.
That have one. It’s called the CCP.
Hey, how come you didn’t get the snide arrogant insults for saying the same thing I did? I’m jealous! ;-)
Typical day in America…except we can’t afford the actual hospital and die working from home
Nowhere near the same.
Labor protection laws are basically shit and have largely been eroding since FDR almost a hundred years ago, but we don’t have the 996 mentality here by a long shot.
Food pantries are everywhere. It’s not like latin america where starvation is much of an issue almost everywhere if you don’t have a job. No idea how the food situation is in China, but I can’t imagine them handing out free food to anybody.
ERs accept everyone, but all they can do is basic treatment of acute conditions. In civilized states like Massachusetts they have state sponsored health insurance like MassHealth which covers costs which is partially paid for by medicaid for the poorest people of any age.
Medical debt is incredibly hard to collect on too. Pretty much is the last kind of debt you should ever consider paying if your choice is between paying your mortgage, paying the tax man, or paying medical. Education debt is far worse and impossible to escape short of death though.
The healthcare situation is fucked in the US, but it’s mostly due to insurance companies, lack of regulation for pharma and medical devices, and wages overall.
In terms of jobs, it’s very rare in the US to see companies who want to see workers there over 40 hours a week in the shittiest of jobs which are typically paid hourly and eligible for overtime. In the blue collar world you make bank and they incentivize extra overtime with extra pay on top of overtime rate in the busy seasons depending on trade. In the white collar world it is rare to see anyone working much over 45 hours outside of a handful of toxic roles and upper leadership positions / highly compensated roles like management consulting.
Americans just don’t understand how good they have it, despite all the awful flaws thanks to billionaires owning politics. Yeah, it can definitely be better and we should ask for better… but when you start looking at the rest of the world, the overwhelming majority can’t comprehend our quality of life. Air conditioning? practically unheard of for more than half the world mostly living much closer to the equator where heat is literally killing people.
Im not sure where you’re seeing companies only want you for 40hours. Kitchens and serving you are often expected to work more than 40hours. Sure you may get overtime if your boss isint a theif but whats overtime on minimum wage or even a bit above? Barely anything. Salaried positions its also very strongly implied that you will put in more than 40 hours in many places. Sure you dont have to but expect to stagnate or be put on PIPs
I don’t see people pushing much beyond 40 hours in professional environments. I work in IT and have been exposed to many industries through consulting and long term contracts. Admittedly i’m close to an urban center with fairly high cost of living but that’s where the good jobs are usually. Rural areas / closer to FPL and you start having struggles, but there’s still SNAP and Medicaid.
I also know someone who has a full time office job making ~130k TC and they also have an almost full time side gig of being a waitress who also does the schedule and hiring (so waitress manager) and she schedules herself for the busy nights, but especially friday/saturday and sports nights. Her top tipping nights can be 1k+, but this is in fairly hcol area. She put three of her kids through college doing this because she can hustle. She sure didn’t start out with this though, like most of us didn’t.
There’s shitty jobs all over, but if we’re talking anything near median wage (66k in the US) the problems you are talking about largely go away. It’s not hard to find a job to coast at though if that’s your goal… but if you’re working retail or are wait staff and making nothing on your shifts, you should find a better place to work at. Criminal records are usually the only real thing preventing this, otherwise it’s usually a preference or choice. There’s opportunity if you pursue it, but not if you disqualify yourself or limit yourself for personal reasons.
It’s not like latin america where starvation is much of an issue almost everywhere if you don’t have a job
1 in 8 USians is on SNAP. 1/3 of people on SNAP are employed.
Source: https://www.ers.usda.gov/data-products/chart-gallery/chart-detail?chartId=55416 and this is easier to read: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2025/11/14/what-the-data-says-about-food-stamps-in-the-us/
Yep. Food assistance for everyone. My parent was on it when I was young. My wife’s family has been on it at times after losing a house to a natural disaster and their workplace closing from going out of business.
It’s nice to have social programs that prop up the vulnerable.
Ooh, I see. Your argument is not that “people with jobs don’t go hungry in the USA”, but “it’s worse in Latin American countries famously exploited by the USA”.
Got it.
Keep on moving those goalposts. Now you’re claiming I think the US is innocent or a good country. lol
They don’t do a fraction of what they should do. There’s way too many ignorant fucks in this country letting countless wealthy assholes do whatever they want. It’s disgusting.
I think the poorest in the US, the ones working shitty retail jobs, have it much better than they possibly realize. Don’t get me started on the vast excesses of wealth afforded to the middle class or anybody making more than median.
Odds are you have some serious privilege too, just because you’re on here with the rest of us.
This comment is so frustrating 😅 one of the only concrete statements you make about Chinese policy is “i cant imagine them handing out free food to anybody”. Literally political criticism based on vibes.
You’re welcome to provide any information, instead of complaining and providing absolutely nothing.
I don’t understand why it’s on everyone else to research baseless claims you are making, but sure, whatever lmao.
So to even answer the question you have to specify what exactly you mean by food bank. Providing food for people who are impoverished takes many different forms. From individual meal based facilities like soup kitchens, to dry and preserved goods providers, to international warehousing of emergency food relief supplies.
So assuming the question at hand is, does the government of China provide its citizens with any kind of nutritional assistance? Yes, they do. The available facilities vary by region, city, and even district levels. Most of the development of large organized food relief organizations has been relatively recent, with the first to adopt a “food bank” label starting in Shanghai in 2015. Between 2015 and 2023 the Oasis public food bank setup facilities across China formalized as a national network of food relief facilities.
At the same time the government of China has worked with public enterprises in China including restaurant chains and grocery stores to implement “Surplus food programs” to reduce food waste and redistribute food to relief programs and facilities.
This was all information I found on my own with pretty basic cursory searches in about 20 minutes. There is far more public information out there and I would encourage you to use free resources to research subjects yourself before making foundationless statements like that.
You’re a tool and you’re holding up a strawman argument, and you’ve even changed your own story now.
You started out with:
This comment is so frustrating 😅
Which I am sure it is for you. It doesn’t really say anything negative or concrete about china, AT ALL. It makes no claims about china. And you even acknowledge it… but try to stir up some shit without actually finding anything to stir up. It’s like you’re just a propagandist trying to say america bad, which they are for a myriad of reasons, but it’s not because people can’t be admitted to hospitals or they are dying from overwork - which is what I replied to originally.
😅 one of the only concrete statements you make about Chinese policy is “i cant imagine them handing out free food to anybody”. Literally political criticism based on vibes.
I didn’t make a “concrete statement” about anything. And you conveniently omitted the first part of the sentence that literally said “I don’t know the food situation in china” didn’t you? Because you’re holding up the imaginary argument of “china doesn’t have even a single food bank” as your strawman argument, and you had no clue either way, because you had to google it, idiot.
China’s median wage is close to 6k/year. Chile and Uruguay is close to 12k/year. The dominican republic is ~7400/year, and they absolutely do not have any kind of real food assistance program outside of the smallest scope. Chile does have something a lot more substantial, but they make wayyyy more. Given that china is poorer in terms of median wage than any of these, that’s going to be the case for a lot of workers away from wealthy median areas.
The fact that China is even on the Global Hunger Index site shows that hunger is still a challenge. They are near the top of the chart with many of the latin american countries i’ve listed. Globally hunger has been much less of a problem in the past 10 years than ever before, only in truly troubled countries do you find horrific levels, like in Haiti or Somalia - and nobody is saying china is anything like those in the overwhelming majority of the country. Not having food banks is way less than mass food insecurity… it’s the missing gap between healthy income levels and
China does have a dibao system for an extremely area by area “basic income” where they give people a pittance per month that can partially subsidize what they have, but there’s no real federal style food assistance beyond that. China spends more money on food than any other category in rural areas by a huge margin, and you don’t need to take my word for it. You can check the PRC’s own statistics instead of “googling it” like an ignorant moron.
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Overall Median income is ~41k yuan or ~5,900. About 1.4 billion people in total.
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Urban Median income is ~54k yuan or ~$7,800. This is about 952 million people.
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Rural Median Income is only ~23k yuan or ~$3,300 or so. This is about 452 million people.
That rural amount is despairingly low and since it’s median half of the people in rural areas make less…this is unbelievably below poverty level in so many countries around the world. Food insecurity must be a major challenge in rural areas since with that kind of income food costs become paramount to all others.
The statistics I linked from the CCCP also call out rural spending on “food, tobacco and liquor” because clearly food is in the same category as getting lung cancer sticks and fucking your body up with booze (priorities right) and that comes out to 6226 yuan, or just shy of $900 a year. When ~32% of your income is going to just food, smokes and booze, losing a job puts you in dire straits. In poorer rural areas the “basic income” from dibao is only 200($28) to 300($43) yuan a month, and you still need to have clothes, a place to live, etc. 3600 yuan ($519/year) - I think everyone knows this isn’t going to be nearly enough.
There’s no way food banks originating from extremely wealthy urban areas ten years ago are suddenly reaching the majority of Chinese. It’s not even a state sponsored thing (yay communism, helping the people!) I still have substantial doubt as to how much food assistance there is even in many urban areas, because I know how tough food tends to be when money is tight in countries that are generally poor (but not troubled like Haiti.) Food assistance programs can only subsidize a small portion, as we see with SNAP in the US. Wait… snap is the american government food assistance program? Who are the communists again?
You said “I feel like China wouldn’t give out free food.” in the context of food banks. I made no claims about America. I made no claims about anything other than your statement “I feel like China wouldnt give out free food.” I was frustrated because you are making a feelings based statement about verifiable factual information that is accessible online.
You go to great lengths in this comment to say that China has had issues with citizens not having enough food, which makes sense, why else would they make food banks if no one needed the food???
I also stated exactly how recent these developments are in my previous comment. These are ongoing changes based on the literature I found and read on the subject. Nowhere in my comment did I suggest that no one in China is dealing with nutritional problems and nowhere did I suggest that China was doing everything in its power to solve those problems.
I only responded to your feelings based statement with verifiable information I was easily able to find online. You said something that suggested that there are no food relief programs in China, that suggestion was wrong. I clarified it for you when you refused to clarify it yourself. I am entirely uninterested in engaging with you on any other point here. Frankly a lot of your language betrays a very strong emotional bias in this discussion and I do not think you are interested in a legitimate discussion about food relief problems and existing programs in China.
As a side note it’s so typical for people in any discussion about China to just label random people propagandists. Yes for sure I’m a propagandist on a social media forum that sees less throughput than an average Facebook group. Tankies call me western interference and American liberals say I’m a paid propagandist. Imagine that there could be any nuance in discussing a nation comprising over a billion people, crazy I know right.
You’re just a moron and your word vomit reads like it’s written by AI.
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Most poorer people work two or three jobs because they can’t get full time jobs with healthcare or benefits. Which means they work 40+ hours every week regardless because it’s all they can do to survive.
He reads like heavy cope.
but we don’t have the 996 mentality here by a long shot
When I was in China I have memories of my mom taking me to her workplace when I was a kid (I think because nobody was at home, grandma was supposed to be watching us but I can’t remember why she wasn’t available for some reason), she worked in some electronic store doing sales.
I remember play some (probably bootleg) games on a portable DVD player and like you put this disc in it then you connect a controller and voila… you play video games on it…
I remember feeling so lonely just by myself in this sort of mall-like place with a lot of people walking by, while mom worked, barely had time to check on me… so I just played games alone by myself… I mean I don’t remember it vividly as in every detail, I was still like either like preschool/kindergarden age or 1st/2nd grade, but I remember the general vibe around there. I had an older brother but he wasn’t there so idk whete the hell he was. I remember the direction to my mom’s workplace (by now, I’ve forgotten it, but I used to just have a sense of direction)
But yea mom was so busy, dad had trouble finding a stable job, constantly job-seeking.
“Childcare” is just finding relatives, usually the kid’s grandparents, according to my mom, it’s said that my paternal grandparents, US permanent residents, refused to watch over us even during their short visit from the US.
Mom worked overtime a lot. Like I remember sometimes just being at home and mom and dad come home so late.
My aparment had this weird child-proof lock thingy that my parents could just lock in from the outside in case no adults was home since they didn’t want their kids to go wandering outside. (firehazard lol, jeez dad wtf)
ERs accept everyone, but all they can do is basic treatment of acute conditions.
Not sure how they are as of right now, but in China, for a long time, they’d require you to pay before getting ER treatment
Medical debt is incredibly hard to collect on too.
In China, they can go after family members…
Americans just don’t understand how good they have it
Lol I remember my family didn’t have internet until we left China…
I lived in a very slum-looking area of Guangzhou right next to the 白云山 (Baiyun mountain). I asked recently about the internet thing and my dad said they were just starting to install internet like very late, like around 2010 around when we left, my dad said it was expensive… so for us, we never got internet in China
Never got to experience the “golden age of internet” that most of y’all talk about… cuz I didn’t even get an internet at all.
Parents didn’t really use internet until like 2014 and smartphones became ubiquitious and then soon afterwards they installed Wechat. That’s like the only thing they use lol.
There’s a lot of like worker safety stuff that China just doesn’t have, also no independent unions and strike-action was uncommon and almost unheard of until we got to the US and then hear about strikes on the news so often it’s kinda a culture shock.
Food safety was so… meh…
Mom mom used to warn me about the food safety thing all the time, stories about people smuggling in milk formula from Hong Kong because there was so much fake milk in mainland. My mom didn’t trust the milk and she said she just breastfed me. Water needs to be boiled… When I found out that Americans just drank from the tap, that was sort of a culture shock.
So after I found out about that, I often drink from the tap cuz I’m often thirsty and didn’t wanna waste time boiling water, also didn’r like warm water… I mean why not, we’re in the US after all (as long as “Flint, Michigan” doesn’t happen its gonna be fine), my parents still have the habit of boiling water… I feel like they’re just wasting electricity lol…
The only thing I liked was the subways in Guangzhou had the platform safety doors… I remember when I first arrived in NYC, I often have fears about just falling into the tracks, cuz the lack of doors… but yea that’s like the safety doors only thing I really missed
What’s funny is your experience is similar to mine except my family was Hispanic and living in the USA. I went to work with my mom or dad s lot too, both before and after school, even up to my preteens.
We didn’t boil the tap but we didn’t really drink it either - it smelled weird (later testing showed it had some heavy metals and other hazardous chemicals - likely from the nearby refineries) - instead we went to this water well thing where we would out 5 gallon jugs of water (like the one in water coolers) and got water they’re for drinking.
We did get the internet sooner, at least I suppose. But for awhile my experience with the internet were those “free trial” discs the companies gave because internet was (and I hear still is) expensive.
I had a very similar childhood in the US.
I sat at a booth and played with coloring books while my mom worked in a restaurant’s kitchen, dad’s work was seasonal and very irregular. We didn’t drink the tapwater in our little town because it didn’t smell right and even came out discolored a few times; instead we’d drive to springs where a bunch of other people got their water too.
“Wealthy” white american here, child of a single parent. Third generation in the US. I went to work with said parent or family and was offloaded to childcare at YMCA or relatives or often just hanging out at the pizza place where said parent worked. I made a lot of pizza boxes over the years. I also got a lot of free pizza.
I rode the bus to school because it was cheap throughout childhood until basically high school when I could walk from my house. There were periods I walked to and from school though, even as young as 7 years old. I was most often one of the poorest families in an incredibly wealthy town. A town I can’t possibly afford to buy a home in today despite having a great job.
I didn’t have hot water in one of the houses I grew up in for over a decade. Never had to boil water though thankfully but one of the neighboring towns had a catastrophe ruining their water supply. Before I was born, my family lived in that town. We had an AC by the time I was a teenager but was instructed to never put it below ~78f with low fan speed or so. I’m totally fine today without AC and just fans… but once I got a good career I swapped to whatever AC temp I wanted, it’s the luxury I always wanted.
Modern QOL in the US is absolutely insane compared to 40 years ago, even with current difficult economy challenges.
When I travel I see conditions way worse than what we had then for most humans, but i’m not traveling to wealthy nations typically. I also don’t bother with shitty expensive resorts. Give me Lima any day (oh my god the food, best in the world imo.)
Same boat as you but was always driven to and from school via one of my parents. However, my father worked late hours because he was a farmer so I would stay at school till 7 sometimes when I was with him that week (had divorced parents).
Americans just don’t understand how good they have it
Yes.
Air conditioning? practically unheard of for more than half the world mostly living much closer to the equator where heat is literally killing people.
Well, not unheard of, but the way you over there use it is. Slight correction - yes. Turning it full on to have temperature 10 Celsius degrees lower than on the outside - no.
It’s not like latin america where starvation is much of an issue almost everywhere if you don’t have a job. No idea how the food situation is in China, but I can’t imagine them handing out free food to anybody.
Honestly almost everywhere outside of the golden billion countries starvation is an issue if you don’t have a job.
Regarding AC
Well, not unheard of, but the way you over there use it is. Slight correction - yes. Turning it full on to have temperature 10 Celsius degrees lower than on the outside - no.
I said half of the world, which is completely accurate. It is completely unheard of for a huge swath of humanity. The energy costs are INSANE to run a heat pump in 2026 prices outside of the wealthy elite globally. Let’s arbitrarily say top 10% or so of earners, which is something between 35k and 47k… hardly a princely sum in the US, given that the US median is something like 62k.
There are places in latin america that have air conditioning, obviously. It’s exceptionally uncommon based on my firsthand experience though outside of tourist areas like hotels and high end restaurants. There are wealthy areas in nearly every country on earth that are exceptions to the rule.
I know, I know. Another reason it’s uncommon is because the risks of catching serious cold at summer are not worth it.
lol, what? You have to maintain filters, but if maintained properly it isn’t going to be causing all kinds of colds. If you’re immunocompromised and it’s an unmaintained system then perhaps. Filtering the air should be a net positive.
Most of the colds I get are september to may, aligning with kids going to school and parents bringing in their illnesses to work and social meetups (in US this is thanksgiving, christmas - i’m sure these things depend on the place.)
I meant the quick change from hot weather outside under sun to conditioned weather inside.
That kinda happens. It’s not about maintenance of systems. Similarly to cold drinks at summer.
There are many that are not on the news
yea was about to say the only difference between this article and the US is that in the US it would be death in the office or at home not the hospital bed.
Except that the US requires hospitals to treat those who arrive in the ER¹ then they bill you to bankrupt you later. In China, you have to pay first before getting even emergency treatment. (Common trope in Chinese TV shows is a character gets sick and family can’t pay for an expensive emergency surgery and they somehow find a rich relative to pay for it)
(¹excluding chronic conditions like cancer, apparantly)
All the more reason for AI to replace us! /s
A random person dies by ordinary reasons - without sources - but he was Chinese, so therefore we just write it anyway…
Nonsense ‘article’…
Lmfao, the fake communist would rather ignore the health risks of over work to blindly support a fake communist country. Tell me you’re Wumao without telling me you’re Wumao. 🤣🤡
When I see on Lemmy a post about immigrants in Spain (my homeland) dying in summer due to heatstroke being overworked at 39°C, I’ll believe you. Until then, shut up, propagandist
Oh, when did you post these prior?
I didn’t. I’m say the news exists… but Lemmy doesn’t have it. Which is a problem with Lemmy.
The user who initially commented suggested that the entire act of writing an article about this topic was only because it was about China. Which is just the favoring China, for… whatever reason.
But, to your complaint, I agree there are a lot of countries that don’t get enough coverage on Lemmy. It’s usually US and China, because Lemmy has a large population of fake communists who hate the US, and have never been to China.
I would enjoy knowing more about what is going on in the world outside of the loud countries.
This post wasn’t posted by “fake commies”, it was posted precisely by libs. It’s atrocity propaganda of working conditions in China to make people dislike the country, and I posted my comment because it’s patent that you don’t care about the living conditions of the working class as much as you care about doing dunks on China because you dislike its form of socialism
It was posted because it was written. The person complaining about the article was a fake communist.
You’re, suspiciously, trying to twist words to your own desire. But I’m sorry, you’re just wrong.
I’m not the one complaining about articles pointing out poor living conditions. They did.
Then you, suspiciously, pop up trying to gaslight me into coming off as the bad guy? WOW. Try harder.
Maybe you should care about the living conditions of the working class in China for once in your life.
China isn’t socialism. Lmfao, Wumao.
wumao implies they get paid, western tankies just like to bootlick for free
We can’t confirm their status.
Wumao refers to posters who post unrelated content to disengage conversations around subjects that are critical of China. The term also referred to a phenomenon on chinese social media platforms, and alleged that the community party was paying people to make the posts. The majority of people engaging in that pattern of content are members of the communist party, party officials in any capacity.
I know what it means and I mean what it means
Is Lemmy a chinese social media platform? :o
Also, you’re using the term to describe someone who is not engaging in the behavior the term is meant to describe.
Lemmy.ML. You know exactly what I’m talking about, you’re choosing to be ignorant.
I genuinely did not know that, I had not checked what instance they were from.
You’re essentially saying theyre a paid disinformation disseminator? But thats not what wumao means. It also doesnt describe a phenomenon in western online spaces, but rather one on China’s social media networks. I’m not making a statement of agreement or disagreement with the idea that theyre a paid bad actor. I am calling out your usage of the term wumao.
You know what I’m saying, you’re purposefully pretending to be ignorant because you support them. Or, they are your alt. Few people here are confused what I mean, even if they disagree with me.
Wumao
today I learned…
How is poohie doing these days?
